This topic contains 14 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by 
BHudson 3 weeks, 2 days ago.
-
Posts
-
Hello,
I have purchased some metal infused filament in hopes of trying it, but now I was thinking that Robox has a 0.3mm nozzle that might get clogged while getting cleaned before the print, even if I set it up to only use 0.8mm nozzle to avoid clogs.
Is it okay to try to print with a 80% metal 20% binder(probably PLA) filament? Will it not wear my nozzles and especially not get stuck in the 0.3mm one?
Another question would be about carbon fiber filament:
Are the Robox Version2 head nozzles made from a hardened material to avoid carbon wear and tear on the nozzles?
Hope you can help me!
The nozzles will be worn quickly using this filament but there will also be wear on every section of the filament path. Imagine dragging sandpaper over a small area for a long period.
Inside the QuickFill (single material) head there is a chamber which is fed by one material input and joins both the 0.3mm and 0.8mm nozzles which are opened as required by the software.
Either nozzle may be able to allow that material to flow and if it does you should be sure to open each occasionally to purge out the metal powder which will be left inside.
We have not tested this material and do not recommend the use of filled materials.
Obviously your warranty on all the parts in the filament path will not be valid once you use this material.
@murloc992 The only filaments covered under warranty are those available as profiles in AutoMaker, and therefore available on a SmartReel. The two materials you mention are not currently supported by either of the available head designs for two reasons:
- With the single material head(s) SM/S2, the melt chamber is quite large and shared between both nozzles. Therefore if you are doing a print which only uses one nozzle (the majority at the moment), material will not be flowing through one of the nozzles and the material will be sat inside at printing temperature for the duration of the print until the next mini-purge is performed at the start of the next print. With the majority of metal filaments we have tried, the matrix/binder for the metal powder is PLA based, and the problem with PLA is that it degrades very quickly when kept at temperature, causing the polymer to break down and the viscosity to drop dramatically. This drop in viscosity allows the matrix to leak out through the needle valve over the course of a print, leaving just the metal powder behind. Therefore if you complete a long print without using both nozzles, it is quite likely you will end up with the unused nozzle full of 100% metal powder which is essentially impossible to clear/unblock. We have spoken to manufacturers about using a more thermally stable matrix such as ABS or CO-PET, but so far we haven’t found one. It is therefore currently impossible to print these types of filament on SM/S2.
On DM heads, there is only one melt chamber and it is flowing all the time during the course of the print, and should therefore be fine for filled filaments. However, we have not yet released any filled filaments on SmartReels as it requires software changes to constrain certain filaments to certain head types, therefore preventing users causing damage. I would say that you can print filled filaments with DM heads, but you must be prepared to replace the head if there is a problem until we have completed further testing and software changes which allow us to cover it under warranty. - Many filaments are abrasive, including as you mention short-chopped carbon fibre, and indeed glow-in-the-dark filaments too. Glow in the dark filaments contain a phosphorescent pigment based on Strontium Oxide Aluminate, which on Moh’s mineral(!) scale is somewhere between Quartz and Topaz i.e. *very* hard. This will cause very accelerated wear on the brass nozzles used in all current Robox heads, and you will likely need to replace the nozzle after less than 1/2kg of printing - I have seen photos of brass nozzles with square orifices that have grown in diameter by upto 0.5mm with just a small amount of filament. We are currently working on sourcing both hardened blocks and nozzles which will allow you to print with a wider variety of materials, and also on a head without needle valves, again opening up the options for more difficult materials that require higher temperatures etc.
As mentioned in my other post, this new design will also allow you to replace nozzles for different diameters and also if they experience wear. We are currently looking at making nozzles and blocks from stainless steel which can be heat treated to achieve a hardness of 55-65HRc i.e. *very* hard, and therefore they should be able to resist all available abrasive filaments for much more printing, and with the nozzles being replaceable, this is less of an issue.
So to clarify - not yet, all current heads have brass nozzles and are therefore not suitable. We will hopefully announce a head soon which will allow for printing these types of filament under warranty, and also the SmartReel materials to go alongside.
@chrisyt “The only filaments covered under warranty are those available as profiles in AutoMaker, and therefore available on a SmartReel.”
This was my understanding but when I asked about printing PC-Plus in a support ticket I was informed that it is not a supported filament, despite having a profile in Automaker.
@evilsteve - apologies, I’m not sure where that information came from - was it me?! If the profile is available, it’s supported - you can buy PC-Plus on a SmartReel in the US right now… https://www.circuitspecialists.com/robox_polymaker_pc-plus_clear_3d_filament.html
@chrisyt - Thanks for the quick response Chris! No, it wasn’t you 🙂 I’ll try printing it again, I noticed the new version of Automaker has an updated profile for it with increased bed temperature, which is what I opened the ticket about originally.
@murloc992 These two filaments are not available on a SmartReel nor due they have profiles in AutoMaker. They can be used with Robox, but they are use at your own risk as they have not undergone testing and certification by CEL.
If your extruder is gray, you should be able to print flexible filaments, but depending on which one you try you will get different results. There is a forum section with discussions and the consensus is that flex filaments are challenging to work with. I have used several and get good results, but it took a long time to get there.
I operate two Betas and one Production Robox.
I am the US/Canada Technical Support engineer for the Robox.
See my 3D Hub site at https://www.3dhubs.com/phoenix/hubs/ben@murloc992 I’ve used nGen Flex and it prints easily. It’s not, however, very flexible after printing.
I have, however, only used the one type of flex filament.
I’ve printed stuff with ninjaflex. It requires some patience and experience (keeping filament after extruder compressed so filament detection switch is engaged, for instance) but it prints quite well.
Prints retain all rubbery properties 🙂
We would love to release filaments like Ninjaflex on SmartReels as it is possible to get great prints. We have decided not to for now, as the others said it is challenging. It is hard to fit this into our “easy to use” system as the true flex filaments are not “easy to use” although once you get it working it is fairly reliable. nGen Flex is quite easy to use but as said it is not so much flexible as bendable, once stretched it does not return to it’s shape, Ninjaflex can be deformed and will spring back into shape. nGen flex will appear on SmartReels soon as it is easy to use.
- With the single material head(s) SM/S2, the melt chamber is quite large and shared between both nozzles. Therefore if you are doing a print which only uses one nozzle (the majority at the moment), material will not be flowing through one of the nozzles and the material will be sat inside at printing temperature for the duration of the print until the next mini-purge is performed at the start of the next print. With the majority of metal filaments we have tried, the matrix/binder for the metal powder is PLA based, and the problem with PLA is that it degrades very quickly when kept at temperature, causing the polymer to break down and the viscosity to drop dramatically. This drop in viscosity allows the matrix to leak out through the needle valve over the course of a print, leaving just the metal powder behind. Therefore if you complete a long print without using both nozzles, it is quite likely you will end up with the unused nozzle full of 100% metal powder which is essentially impossible to clear/unblock. We have spoken to manufacturers about using a more thermally stable matrix such as ABS or CO-PET, but so far we haven’t found one. It is therefore currently impossible to print these types of filament on SM/S2.
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
