Topic: RESOLVED: Problem with vase printing - Spiral print is not supported

Technical Forums Technical Support RESOLVED: Problem with vase printing - Spiral print is not supported

This topic contains 67 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by  Alexandre Contat 1 year, 4 months ago.

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  • #27195

    Lahminator Lahmi @lahminator
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version

    First thing: I posted this in the software subfolder on this forum first, but this seems to be the better Place. Please delete the other one.

    Hi, I am trying to print a vase using automaker.

    I found the file rbx_vase.stl on the medium that came with the printer. The best Result I was able to get up to now was using the cura engine, but the slicer seems to think that it needs to add material in overhanging areas, which ruins the nice look of the vase. It puts a second perimeter only in these areas. !Not nice!

    My aim is to have a 0.8 mm thick perimeter that is only one perimeter thick. 0.8 because of the 0.8 nozzle. I would like to go to a layer hight of 0.8 mil but it seems it won´t let me.(maximum of 0.3) I even tried the advanced spiral setting using both the cura and slicer engine but it only printed the bed and started to go crazy afterwards on both. Slicer also does not seem to be happy with one perimter of 0.8 with at all because it printed only a very very thin structure with holes in it. I hope you can repuduce my problem with all these informations. I investigated quiet closely on the subject, but found no solution.

    Thanks in advance from Lahminator.

    My settings:

    {
    “version” : 4,
    “profileName” : “Vase”,
    “slicerOverride” : “Slic3r”,
    “firstLayerHeight_mm” : 0.3,
    “layerHeight_mm” : 0.3,
    “fillDensity_normalised” : 0.0,
    “fillPattern” : “LINE”,
    “fillEveryNLayers” : 1000,
    “solidLayersAtTop” : 0,
    “solidLayersAtBottom” : 3,
    “numberOfPerimeters” : 1,
    “brimWidth_mm” : 0,
    “spiralPrint” : false,
    “firstLayerExtrusionWidth_mm” : 0.8,
    “perimeterExtrusionWidth_mm” : 0.8,
    “fillExtrusionWidth_mm” : 0.8,
    “solidFillExtrusionWidth_mm” : 0.8,
    “topSolidFillExtrusionWidth_mm” : 0.8,
    “supportExtrusionWidth_mm” : 0.8,
    “nozzleParameters” : [ {
    “name” : null,
    “closedPosition” : 0.0,
    “openPosition” : 1.0,
    “diameter” : 0.3,
    “openOverVolume” : 0.0,
    “preejectionVolume” : 0.0,
    “ejectionVolume” : 0.25,
    “openValueAtMidPoint” : 0.0,
    “midPointPercent” : 0.0,
    “wipeVolume” : 0.2,
    “partialBMinimum” : 0.5,
    “travelBeforeForcedClose” : 0.0
    }, {
    “name” : null,
    “closedPosition” : 0.0,
    “openPosition” : 1.0,
    “diameter” : 0.8,
    “openOverVolume” : 0.0,
    “preejectionVolume” : 3.0,
    “ejectionVolume” : 0.55,
    “openValueAtMidPoint” : 0.0,
    “midPointPercent” : 0.0,
    “wipeVolume” : 0.4,
    “partialBMinimum” : 0.5,
    “travelBeforeForcedClose” : 0.0
    } ],
    “firstLayerNozzle” : 1,
    “perimeterNozzle” : 1,
    “fillNozzle” : 1,
    “supportNozzle” : 1,
    “supportInterfaceNozzle” : 1,
    “maxClosesBeforeNozzleReselect” : 100,
    “generateSupportMaterial” : false,
    “supportOverhangThreshold_degrees” : 40,
    “forcedSupportForFirstNLayers” : 0,
    “supportPattern” : “RECTILINEAR”,
    “supportPatternSpacing_mm” : 2.0,
    “supportPatternAngle_degrees” : 0,
    “firstLayerSpeed_mm_per_s” : 8,
    “perimeterSpeed_mm_per_s” : 15,
    “smallPerimeterSpeed_mm_per_s” : 10,
    “externalPerimeterSpeed_mm_per_s” : 15,
    “fillSpeed_mm_per_s” : 15,
    “solidFillSpeed_mm_per_s” : 25,
    “topSolidFillSpeed_mm_per_s” : 25,
    “supportSpeed_mm_per_s” : 35,
    “bridgeSpeed_mm_per_s” : 25,
    “gapFillSpeed_mm_per_s” : 20,
    “interfaceSpeed_mm_per_s” : 40,
    “enableCooling” : true,
    “minFanSpeed_percent” : 60,
    “maxFanSpeed_percent” : 100,
    “bridgeFanSpeed_percent” : 100,
    “disableFanFirstNLayers” : 0,
    “coolIfLayerTimeLessThan_secs” : 60,
    “slowDownIfLayerTimeLessThan_secs” : 15,
    “minPrintSpeed_mm_per_s” : 5,
    “printRaft” : false,
    “raftBaseLinewidth_mm” : 1.0,
    “raftAirGapLayer0_mm” : 0.5,
    “interfaceLayers” : 1,
    “raftBaseThickness_mm” : 0.3
    }

    • This topic was modified 2 years, 6 months ago by  Pete. Reason: I edited the title to match the content
    • This topic was modified 2 years, 2 months ago by  Chris White.
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    #27197

    hagster @hagster
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version
    UK

    @lahminator what version of Automaker are you using. There is a bug in the beta AM2.00.01 that means it doesnt work with the 0.8mm nozzle.

    Also, of you could set the layer height to 0.8mm (assuming you dont mean really mean mil) the layer bonding would be rubbish. Imagine stacking 0.8mm circles, the contact arrea would be infinitesimally small. It needs to be somewhat lower to squish a bit.

    #27198

    Lahminator Lahmi @lahminator
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version

    Using 1.03.00 Version, but it looks like a bug as well.

    I mean 0.8mm sry, I am german. About the circles, yes and no, because I plan to do overextruding there, meaning it would be something like 1.0mm circles, needs calibration of cause.

    My main concern her still is cura slicing it the way it does.

    Thanks @hagster.

    #27199

    hagster @hagster
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version
    UK

    Which nozzle was it printing with?

    Did you copy your profile from the Draft profile?

    #27200

    Lahminator Lahmi @lahminator
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version

    It was printing with the right nozzle which is in my opinion the 0.8 one and the draft file was my original settings file yes. But it has been modifyed.

    #27201

    hagster @hagster
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version
    UK

    Sounds like everything should be ok. I havent tried a single perim vase on the Robox yet and dont have access to the machine at the moment. Hopefully someone else can give it a quick test. Its a CEL model so there should be a good way to print it.

    #27202

    Lahminator Lahmi @lahminator
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version

    I agree with you: It is a cel model and there should be a possible way to print it.

    To pronounce the main problem:

    1. Cura does the one perimeter, but is is doing so as layers not as a continous movment upwards.(steps visible)
    2. Cura adds a second layer on the inside in some areas, because it thinks they are needed for support.
    3. Slicer doesn´t do the one perimeter thing at all.
    #27203

    hagster @hagster
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version
    UK

    Ok, im a bit clearer now. Spriral prints are not possible on the Robox currently. Im guessing you must be manually editing the profile in a text editor to select it. What happens when you do this is probably a bit unpredictable. Best bet would be to add it to the feature request thread.

    To get the cleanest possible z scar currently you need to calibrate the nozzle valves and also measure the exact diameter of the filament.

    #27204

    Lahminator Lahmi @lahminator
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version

    The spiral mode enabled in the settings screws up the print, so that is a no go.

    The z scar as you call it wouldn´t be there if there were a true spiral mode, as you could just go a little further up while going around (not layer based).

    Last but not least CEL is advertising this with a youtube video:

    http://www.cel-robox.com/gallery-media/video-kickstarter-update-2-spiral-print-150%C2%B5m-abs/

    This is the exact thing I want to do! So CEL you need to do something here.

    I do not mean to be root, but this is a serious problem for me.

    Despite the trouble with this thing I also want to mention here that your hardware, support and filament shop are GREAT. You need to work on your software though as you lock users into using Automaker at the moment. I would use Simplify 3D if I could.

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    #27208

    hagster @hagster
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version
    UK

    @lahminator i understand your annoyance. Remember that the kickstarter video was made during development and not everything makes it through to the final product(lots of them dont even deliver anything at all). I expect its a feature they would like to add at some point, but doing so comes with a certain development burdon. For every new release they need to backward test all the various features to ensure they are not broken. Its a big ask for a small team. They nearly dropped slic3r to concentrate on Cura at one point, but didnt due to feedback from customers(slic3r is better at small details), so they do listen and take customer requests seriously. The robox is truely great at many many things, but yes it lacks in some of the more advanced slicer features. Hopefully CEL will grow and be able to expand on the current feature set more quickly in the future.

    I had a bit of a internet search and it seems that the Cura spiral mode isnt great anyway and still has steps in it. I tried this on a reprap printer using slic3r. And couldnt get it to work either.

    #27209

    Lahminator Lahmi @lahminator
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version

    @hagster

    I understand your reasoning and you are right, cura is not good at spiral mode indeed. Slic3r has a setting for making it work with spiral designs. (Something like disable structure reinforcments or so. I am not using slicer single.)

    Also I do understand that not every feature can be implemented, but I think a feature that already worked on a product should stay working if you do a new offical release as a company and you are still advertising it…

    The main problem in my opinion here is that CEL is using 3party software here that is made for a specific machine (ultimaker) and is only “compatible” to the Robox. I read through quiet a couple of posts on this forum and I found out that the slicer has been a problem for a long time.

    So what they realy need to do is to get a working software made by themselves out quick. (You need more software devs for that or give it away to a big software company)

    Or and that is what I suggest because of the price: Make up a small microcontroller box that is usb capable and put it in between the robox and the pc. Program a gcode compiler in there that can add the necessary commands used for needlevalves etc. and get compatible to any and all slicers out there.

    Let them do the work of slicing and concentrate on what you at CEL are great at: Desining and producing 3D-Printing Hardware. I am student in Electronics and I tell you: This thing needs to be improved otherwise you will run into a huge problem that may lead to this, in my opinion great company, failing in the 3D-Prining market.

    #27211

    Don Colley @doncolley
    My Robox is a Blue Commercial Version
    South Essex. England.

    What 3d printer have you tried that will print the object?

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